Scott Mueller's Upgrading and Repairing PCs Forum

Thinking of getting a PSU replacement for my Wife's old pc. It has a Corsair cx430 in it currently. She's had a problem recently where it blue-screened and restarted. Blue screen error was related to the video drive. I updated the driver. However I looked in event view and there was a different problem that was labeled as "warning" related to the "Amd northbridge". Cleared all dust out of pc. Re-seated the graphics card. Looked for bulges in the capacitors, but have not seen any. I'll get the details on the warning from event viewer when I can.

Anyway, the PSU is so old I can't even find where I purchased it in any of my online accounts. So I'm thinking of just getting a new one.

I was looking at this Seasonic which looks pretty nice. What do you think?.

I wouldn't replace a power supply unless the existing one failed, and I'm not sure that is what happened here. Scott.

Well I could always replace it and have the one in there now for a "known good spare". She hasn't had any problems with any blue screens since I uninstalled and reinstalled the video driver. I could wait and see if there are any other problems of course but I do like to have new parts. For instance with HDD, when HDD were more popular than SSD, I believe you recommended to replace them every so many years instead of waiting till they failed. This is how I'm leaning with the PSU of this pc. I'm guessing with HDD that recommendation is just to prevent data loss. The PC in question is pretty old but still works fine for what she uses it for. Just browsing the internet and some silly games. Also once in a while she is allowed by her job to work from home and uses SingleComm to take calls for a call center.

Well I did end up replacing it anyway. My New PSU I have questions about though. Shouldn't I be able to feel the air exhaust out of the back of the PSU?. I don't. Absolutely nothing at all. The old Power Supply I could feel air exhaust out the back of it. I don't think I've ever had a power supply where I could not feel air coming out from the back of it.

I contacted Seasonic about it and they say as long as the fan spins than there is nothing wrong with power supply. Another question I had on mounting I looked up...I always thought that the power supply fan, it's function was to help cool the pc somewhat. Most of what I've read online says the same thing. You always face the power supply fan towards the motherboard because it draws or sucks hot air out of the system thought the power supply and out the back of the system. The guy from Seasonic is telling me that the only reason that you would point the power supply fan at the motherboard is that you don't have vents in the other directions. In other words the only function of the Power Supply fan is to cool the power supply. The fan should face up or down depending on where you have a vent on the case, so the fan can draw cooler air from outside the case into the power supply to cool it.

What do think about this Scott?. If this is true could write more about it in the next book?. I've not been able to find anything that says anything close to what the guy from Seasonic is saying to me.

Many systems don't have chassis fans and as such do rely on the PSU fan to cool the chassis as well as the PSU. It doesn't matter where the PSU fan is physically "pointed" as long as it is installed with the airflow in the direction that the case is negatively pressured, that is the air should be entering the PSU from inside the chassis and flowing out the external vents in the PSU.

I previously had much more information on system cooling in the chapter on overclocking and cooling that was included in the 16th through 18th editions. Unfortunately due to new material and the inability to add to the page count it was removed from the 19th and later editions.

For more information I highly recommend reading the detailed documents on chassis thermal design published by Intel, here are a few of them:

http://www.formfactors.org/developer/sp ... tds_10.pdf
https://web.archive.org/web/20120519074 ... _62086.pdf
https://www.intel.com/content/dam/suppo ... -guide.pdf

That is what I always thought Scott- That you were meant to point the power supply fan towards the motherboard and as such it would draw the hot air out of the case into the power supply and out the back vents of the power supply.

What the guy said to me through email was that if you have a case with a vent on the bottom of it you should have the power supply fan pointed towards the vent so it will draw cool air from the outside of the case and into the power supply. He said it's not efficient to have it drawing in hot air from inside the case because that will just make the power supply hotter. He was indicating that the sole function of the power supply fan is to cool down the power supply and has nothing to do with cooling the pc.


I don't think I can tell you word for word what he said though but maybe just this part I can quote,

The question still remains, Shouldn't I be able to feel air blowing out of the back of the power supply regardless of the speed of the fan?. In my mind I would think some kind of force or wind should be perceptible.

I can't comment on "feel". If the fan is spinning then either the air is going in or out and it should be going out! Scott.

Right, that's why I'm a bit concerned. The air has to be going somewhere. If it's being sucked in by the fan and doesn't come out the back, it could be just because of poor design or something isn't right with the fan. Kind of want to get a different brand and return this. Then again it could be the fan only spins when the pc is first started up for awhile and then goes off during normal operation. It speeds up, slows down, or goes off completely based on "load" and PSU temp. The only reason I know it is or was spinning is because I took the side panel off and started it up on my kitchen table to check if it was actually spinning.

I saw in your book that Seasonic is one of the brands you do recommend. Guess I'll just let it be for now.

Well I went to put in my new "refurbished" Pc power & cooling PSU and noticed the 20 pin part of the power connector is broken it seems. More negatives for pc power and cooling






Noticed this AFTER I secured it all in the case. Kind of a pain in the butt putting it in with this case. They said they would ship me out another one tomorrow. Hope that one isn't broken also. Maybe I'll get a Corsair at this point.

I mean it might still technically "work" but the one I sent them in was less than a year old and didn't have any issues like that. Should I trust it and connect everything up and try it out?. I don't think I should. What do you think Scott?. Kind of makes me wonder about these guys and weather or not they are trustworthy anymore. I called and they said they would ship another out tomorrow but no apology or anything....

The pictures don't show anything clearly. Let me know what you decide in the end. Scott.

I can see them pretty clearly. Did you click on each picture to enlarge them? I'm holding the 20 pin connector in between my thumb and index finger. There is a break or hole on the side of the connector.

I believe the "break" or "hole" you speak of is an attachment point for the 4-pin connector to combine the 20 and 4-pin connectors to make a modern 24-pin connector. Unfortunately the pictures are not clear or close enough to accurately say anything more than that. Scott.

I guess I'll have to get a better camera, or learn to take better pictures. There is definitely a hole where there should not be one. Either way, they are shipping another PSU and it went out today. To connect the extra 4 pins there are little "nubs" on each side of the 4 pin connector that just slide under the little plastic edges on the 20 pin connector. The "hole" that I'm describing you should be able to see if you look at the red wire or wires where they go into the plastic connector.

I think I'll try and take some better pictures when I get the new one to compare.

It's a shame that Firepower Technology is selling it's products with the Pc Power & Cooling name. They aren't the same company and the products they sell are inferior to almost all of their competitors.

Still, I am weary of putting this "refurbished" PSU in my computer. Am I correct in thinking that refurbished could just mean that Firepower Technology checked if the power supply unit turned on and if so, "it works" and is "refurbished". In your opinion, would you trust something like this in your own computer?. Scott am I being unreasonable here?. Or am I right to worry about this?

I can always get a Seasonic PRIME Ultra 750W 80+ Titanium Power Supply, Full Modular, 135mm FDB Fan w/Hybrid Fan Control, ATX12V & EPS12V, Power On Self Tester, SSR-750TR for about $10 than I paid for the Silencer 750.

I can also get CORSAIR RMx Series RM750x (CP-9020179-NA) 750W ATX12V / EPS12V 80 PLUS GOLD Certified Full Modular Power Supply which has much better reviews than the Seasonic that I linked and cost less money. Plus it has a 10 year warranty and with the warranty/rma service I've received from Corsair in the past few months I've been really impressed with them.

Firepower technology on the other hand is virtually unheard of today and the power supplies they sell today can easily compete against products sold in 2012. Maybe they are better off sticking with making power supplies for proprietary oem replacements.

I don't know Scott though. Really really want your opinion on this because I trust it. Do you think FirePower Technology produces the same quality products that Pc Power & Cooling did?. The way that they shipped to me was disappointing also. A box only about 1/2 inch wider than the the psu itself. The body of the psu was wrapped in a plastic bag and then the cords attached were wrapped in rubber band. For the packing material they used one sheet of bubble wrap, enough to be wrapped once around the power supply unit. Like I've said before, even though there is no physical damage to the replacement for the replacement doesn't mean the PSU itself isn't damaged.

How will I know it's a damaged if it turns on and runs the pc?. Possibly some intermittent problems, but also I've read that some power supplies can damage other components when they die.

Maybe Firepower technology could get a contract to sell their power supplies here.

Both new cases have a vent with dust-cover on the bottom for bottom mounted power supplies.

dBa Pc Power & Cooling

- from here.

I am wondering if I can replace the connector myself. Not sure of the difficulty level of that.

You can use a terminal pick (aka extraction tool) to remove the terminals from the existing connector housing and then slide them into a new one. Scott.

I ordered this and this today. Seems it wouldn't be that difficult to remove I have seen some videos. Not sure about the difficultly about putting the wires back in. The should go in only one way, correct?.

They should only go in one way... correctly. <g> Look at another properly assembled connector as a guide. Scott.

I found this wiring diagram. However when looking at an identical model atx power connector pin 1 has an orange wire and a brown wire both going to pin 1. The brown wire is much thinner though. So that confuses me a bit.

Ahh, I Just found the answer.



Do both wires connect together to the same "pin" or part that goes in the connector though?. I'm guessing they do, but not sure till I actually try this myself.

The one terminal is crimped around both wires, which you'll see when you take it apart. Scott.

This is extremely difficult to do. I've been messing with the connector for at least an hour now and I'm not able to hear a "click" by putting the two prongs around the outside of the connector on the bottom. Pulling on the wire it doesn't budge.

Tool just broke. Oh well. I'll have to return it and try the one you linked Scott. I don't see how they would be much different. They just look like over priced tweezers.

Ok Scott, well I just ordered the exact one you linked. I hope this one is better quality and I'll try not be too rough with this one. For double the price of what I paid for the other one it should be better quality at least. Hope I didn't ruin anything on the wires but I don't see how I could have really done that. If so maybe I'll pick up some more skills learning how to attach new pins. Now I know I'm even a bigger fan of Fully Modular PSUs....Because if that was the case I would have been able to just order a new cable.

ModMyMods shipped me a replacement tool and I got it today. I was able to get one removed within 5 minutes. Just gotta have patience. I'm not gonna do it all at once though. It was suggested or I read it's easier to replace each pin directly after each removal but I'm not sure about that. Seems it might be more messy and distracting than removing all the pins and then re-pinning them after all are removed.

What do you think Scott?.

I'm not sure but I think I might have broke one of the pins. The thing is it just doesn't look like it's broken. It looks like it was just made that way. The two little "wings" that you are suppose to bend out before inserting the pin- on one side it looks like the other pins did but on the opposite side it just looks like a stub. There are no pieces in the connector and I'm using a headset with magnification and light. Are some made with just one little wing or is it just broken?.

Tried to get a pic but my super old camera still takes blurry pictures. There is still a "nub" on the left side I can bend out, it's just half the length of the one on the right. It is strange to me though because it doesn't look broken and there I haven't seen or can't find the piece. Plus it's not bent out at all. If it was broken I think it would be bent out of shape or something.

Yep I broke the little "wing" on the side. Took a closer look and it was rolled up and inside the pin. I tried pushing it back from the inside and bent the metal a little too far in the wrong direction and boom it broke off. Now I've got purchase a pack of pins and figure out how to remove the old one and put on a new one.

Not sure how to remove the old pin from the wire. I know the new one will need a crimping tool but how to pull off the old one?

Well I got the old pin off and stripped the wire pretty good. I think I just may have to cut it a little shorted when I crimp on the pin. I was thinking of taking one off an old psu that I don't use but I don't that would work very well.

Looks like I'll have to purchase a specific crimper for doing this exact job. I found one that looks pretty easy to use on frozencpu. I will likely just use this psu for testing once I get this done. Looks pretty easy from the video. Video is only 68 seconds so if you want to watch...

Here is what I've done to the wire,



I will have to cut it shorter so the "gauge" is uniform or "thick-ness" the same.

This should be much better. Now the wire is uniform thickness. Click for bigger better pic.

I got my crimper today. This is extremely frustrating. I ruined about 4 pins and then put it away. Gonna try another crimper. The wire is 16 gauge but the tool is rated for 18-30, however in the reviewers people were saying you could use it for 16 anyway, just don't press down all the way. Do 5 clicks instead of 6. I have a different crimper on order that is rated for 16 gauge and can supposedly crimp most anything. It was more expensive than this cheap one so we'll see how that one works.

Would have thought I would have got it within a few tries but nope. Not messing with it again till new I get new crimper.

Also got some more pins that are for 16 AWG. Should be easier to fit the wire in there.

That crimper was not milled so it just crushed the pins. I've got a better high quality one now that is milled. Will try again when I get new pins tomorrow.

I finally made a good crimp. This is after around 6 straight hours of trying to figure it out. Yes 6 hours. I destroyed about 15-20 pins. So happy I was finally able to do it, but I don't think I plan on doing this again. It's much easier to just replace a broken connector and cable by using fully modular power supplies in the first place!

Something that I find a little off is the bottom of the pins don't come out all the way flush with the bottom of the connector. I've looked at other connectors on a different power supply and some of the them have this same "issue" but I'm not even sure if it's a problem or not. I believe the male pins with make contact anyway when pressing the connector fully down.

Got frustrated I saw one pin was down lower inside the connector than the others. Tried to remove that pin and the wire broke off. Tried to get the pieces of the wire off and the pin out of the connector and wasn't able to. I was gonna put it away but I decided to mess with another pin the wasn't down all the way in the connector, same thing happened after I tried using needle nose pliers to pull it out. At least I learned to crimp somewhat but I'm about done with this. I actually have another two power supplies of the same model that were replacements for this one but I thought I might be able to fix it myself but really no need. Gonna drop the PSU off some place to recycle it.

I guess some people like this kind of thing "Modders". For me it made me happy while I was doing good, but 80% of the time it made me so frustrated that I wanted to put my fist through the wall.

Scott I really hope you consider taking "Pc Power & Cooling" AKA "Firepower Technology" off of your "recommended list" for power supplies in your next U&R PCs book.

Yeah they really aren't the same thing at all anymore. Scott.